For now, the bulk of reported cases are related to diesel vehicles. I would like to keep the turbo small so it would spool extremely quickly and the compression high to be responsive. This allows him to see what kinds of issues some of these transmissions come back to the dealer with while under warranty. Recently, they received a 2021 GMC Yukon with a very unusual sound coming from the front of its 10L80 transmission. If the transmission is in the vehicle you can use the RPO tag in the glove compartment. Ive not done the math on total surface area, but its likely the clutch would not last long engaging 450 hp. I am making a great deal of changes to the truck from a Procharged 5.3 to a head, cam, Fast LSXRT intake LS2 on nitrous before we build a 3.9 bore and stroke twin turbo 372ci setup. Engine | Drivetrain | Powertrain Technical Discussions, https://www.delphi.com/dynamic-skip-fire-1. The 6L80Es gear rations are as follows: There are two super easy ways to tell whether or not the transmission is a 6L80E. The 6 speed takes a fair amount of trans tunnel work and my Holley Dominator ECU can't control it. Will this hurt the trani? should check for clearance. SEE, I think it's a 15 pin plug and two wires change on the plug fro 95 to. The Ford 10R80 is a new 10-speed, rear wheel drive transmission that's available in several models, beginning in 2017. Special tools are often needed when diagnosing transmission problems and overhauling units. We had to use a spacer from Advanced Adapters but otherwise they are the same. Shop Finder A typical scene thats now playing out in transmission shops across the country goes something like this: A late-model, full-size truck or SUV is dropped off to get the transmission checked out. TIPM Problems! Seventh 1.00 The complaint A Ford vehicle equipped with the FNR5 transmission has a complaint of a severe slipping condition in reverse. This took the dealership a much longer period of time in acquiring these bolts for Brian to complete the job. The idea behind this conversion offers multiple overlapping advantages. The replacement solenoid band number must match the band number of the solenoid being replaced. Automatic Options - 4L60 and 4L60E. At part pedal, when acceleration is brisk, single-step upshifts would result in very frequent shift events (a very short time in gear). * An extension housing p/n 8673406 (old p/n 24214689) is available for the TH700R4/4L60 transmission that moves the rear transmission mount to the same position as a TH400 (short-style 4" tail) or TH200-4R transmission. Thought's? The 6L80 denotes that the transmission is a 6-Speed, Longitudinally mounted, and for 8000 lbs. The transmission will bolt up but will not work since the TCM, Tehcm and BCM are application specific and cannot interchanged. and it can handle a total gross vehicle weight of 8,600 lb, which makes it a great transmission for LS swaps with no modification needed whatsoever. Team ATF builder Super Dave doing his magic on assembling the First 10L80 transmission ATFSpeed has had come thru the shop. Sonnax is an industry leader in the cutting edge design, manufacture and distribution of the highest quality products to the automotive aftermarket, commercial vehicle industries, and industrial sectors utilizing drivetrain technology. ** Currently 10L80 units are 2017+ so are dealer-only or salvage yard only. The 10-speed first appeared in the 2017 Camaro ZL1 backing up the 650-horsepower, supercharged 6.2L engine. It also contains a durable transmission pan, reliable gear seat, EPC, a 13-vane pump assembly, high-performance cooler, hardened stator shaft with rings and specialized control solenoids. A remanufactured 10L80 on the other hand, is completely remanufactured, and its designed to exceed the manufacturers original specifications. Established Member. Production Began 2017 Complaints of erratic shifting, poor shift quality, missed shifts, and other shifting and TCC control complaints are becoming more common with these units. In contrast, when the 10-speed transmission is at heavy or max throttle, the small steps keep the engine closer to the horsepower peak for the best performance. One needs to realize that the stamped covers are not all that flat to begin with. Concerns can range from any of the following: These drivability concerns can be mistaken for transmission malfunctions. What is most welcome about it is that it is a very durable, functional and impressive transmission assembly and appears to have a terrific prospect with GM and the aftermarket community. Note: The mounting pad is usually a part of the extension housing, but the graphic shows it on the maine case. Indirectly affects shift pressure control. Beginning with the F-150, it then made its way into the Mustang and the Expedition (as well as the Everest, and upcoming Ranger reboot). The Transmission Control Module (TCM) is an adaptive learning, 32-bit computer integrated into the valve body of the 6L80 / 6L90 and communicates with the Engine Control Module via the onboard vehicle CAN bus network. Need to convert 10L80 rom 4wd to 2wd. 2020 10l80 4wd an I one to convert to 2wd. From the workshop on ongoing projects and more, and where the new images are added afterwards. General 10-speed automatic with integral turbine clutch torque converter Problem Owners may experience an ATF leak coming from under the vehicle. It employs an even deeper First gear ratio of 4.02:1 with tighter gear splits but does not apply an overdrive for subsequent gears. The 6L90 has a beefier set of gears and many internal upgrades. Allows easy highway cruising, seamless downshifts, Transbrake and 2nd gear (2.34) leave options through multiple templates tuned independently of the engine management system! The TCM is actually even programmed to adjust its operation for transmission clutch wear. They dealership gave Brian their opinion of what was making the noise. A sectioned image of the 4L60-E TMBX and 6L80, 6L90 JMBX (Figure 3) shows the external profiles of the respective front covers are very similar. A P59 PCM controlled both the engine and the transmission. 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The torque converter is a fluid turbine drive and - like those on its predecessor transmissions, the TH350C, 700R4, 4L60, and 4L80E - features a lock-up pressure plate for direct mechanically coupled driving from the engine crank. And Sonnax doesnt even offer a forged clutch piston for the TMBX there just isnt any demand for one. The height of the standpipe tube attached inside the transmission to the bottom of the pan sets the oil level. The overall First gear ratio is 2.48 x 4.10 = 10.17:1. Comparing the two cross sections, you also quickly see that the orientation of the spring dampers is different. Indirectly affects shift control. You also asked about GM's new 6L80E. This idler gear and ball bearing assembly is mounted to the stator shaft support housing. As the 10 speeds continue to make their way into our shops, keep in mind the more you know about them, the better off youll be. Ford considers this to be a normal condition! The overall First gear ratio is deeper at 2.97:1 which means the car builder can leave a taller rear gear ratio in the rear end and still have great First gear acceleration. The 6L90 transmission is slightly longer and taller than a comparable configuration 6L80 due to its beefier internals. $ 158.00 Select options. or gross weight of 14,000 lbs. 2) Trans vertical position is the same on 200-4R,700R4,4L60,4L65,70E,6L80E. It is currently phasing out the 6L80/6L90 transmissions (although it hasn't done its all the way yet. lbs., with a respectable GVW of 15,000 lbs. Where the original 4L80E First gear is 2.48:1, TCI created a 2.97:1 First gear ratio. Retiring Early The Transmission Industry Has Been a Dream Come True, A two-piece valve body with eight solenoids. Thats a great question. ASK FOR CHAD - Freight Shipping - 90 Day Warranty. The 6L80 / 6L90 TEHCM is located inside of the transmission on the 6L80 / 6L90 valve body. Cost and Process, Torque Converter Problems: Symptoms & Replacement Cost, Transmission Solenoid: Symptoms & Replacement Cost, 10 Pro Tips on Buying Used Transmissions For Sale, P0700: Transmission Control System Malfunction (TCM), Pontiac Firebird Transmission Problems & Cost | 4L60E / 4L65, Cadillac SRX Transmission Problems & Cost | 5L40E | 6L50 | 6T70, Ford Crown Victoria Transmission Problems & Cost | 4R75E / 4R75W / 4R70W, Chevy Equinox Transmission Problems & Cost | 6T70 / 6T45 / AW55-50SN, Saturn Aura Transmission Problems & Cost | 6T70 | 6T40 | 4T45E. As transmission builders know, it can be difficult to determine a root cause when you are looking at a catastrophic failure, with rotating parts crashing into each other. The transmission is automatically shifted featuring performance algorithms to minimize upshifts during closed throttle driving to prevent unnecessary shifting. Accelerate from a stop with light throttle (15%), ensuring that upshifts 1st through 8th occur at engine speeds between 1300-1600 rpm. Lots of good information I do have one question That no one seems to be able to give a good answer to. Legal/Privacy. All I can find is that it is sealed from the rear and just needs a new tail housing but some say its got to be completely rebuilt from the inside. Continue to accelerate (may apply slightly more throttle after 7-8 upshift at 32-38 mph (51-61 km/h) until you achieve 55 mph (88 km/h) and the 8-9 and 9-10 shifts complete. There are too many differences between in communication protocols and renders the transmission nonfunctional. Your email address will not be published. Trans temps climbed to 195 and has stayed there ever since. : 18-NA-355 Special Tools DT-52263 Transmission Fluid Exchange Kit: DT-52263-1 Block Assembly (includes fluid drain The 6L80 would have big shoes to fill, with legendary predecessors like the TH400, 4L80E and 4L60E transmissions. Copyright 2023 - Transmission Repair Cost Guide. To handle the increased output torque capacity, the 6L90 departed from the long-standing GM 32 spline specification output shaft of the 6L80 and went to larger diameter 29 spline for most truck applications. The OE cover and piston are damaged to the point of not being reusable this is where all of the metal you find in the transmission comes from! The 6L80 is a robust transmission and can handle a ton of power. Every modern GM vehicle has one of these sheets in its glove compartment. If thats the case, the valve body will have to be replaced to correct these concerns. Engine torque estimate: Directly affects shift pressure control, TCC control, and transmission diagnostics. Muncie M20 4-speed longitudinal wide ratio manual transmission made by GM at their Muncie, Indiana factory. Shift the transmission to Drive. Its interesting how the new 8- and 10-speed automatics have essentially turned the traditional powertrain ratio scheme 180 degrees. At times the 10-speed transmission may skip gears when the vehicle starts from a complete stop. The 6L80 in its transaxle version for the Corvette. It is now on week number 7 at the dealer for warranty and the GM engineers are running that show only allowing the dealer to replace what they deem necessary. And now, with some of these transmissions coming out of warranty, the aftermarket will soon begin to see issues that occur with them beyond their first years of life during their aging process. By the time a converter rebuilder opens up a JMBX, the damage is done, and it can be hard to see what happened first. Longitudinal transmissions [ edit] Aisin AR5/MA5 5-speed longitudinal manual made by Aisin. Put simply, its the converter. You might run into a lack of valve body repair options. Based around the 4L80E (and fitting wherever a 4L80E will fit), the 6X is a true six-speed transmission that TCI rates at 850-plus horsepower. Internal hydraulic leakage, hard part failures and contaminated/failed solenoids are all issues that can plague units, some more than others. 10R80 transmission swap? It features a dry weight of ~195 lbs. It all comes down to the extra rigidity and flatness of the surfaces. Click Here to Email our Sales & Tech Staff 888-748-4655 Local: 330-965-7146 International: 001-330-652-5855 Mon-Fri 8am-5pm EST Sat-Sun: Closed Stock capacity . Your car is quick! Once there is any metal-to-metal on the TCC surface at all, its usually a short time before debris wipes out the clutch completely. (You can unsubscribe anytime), ATRA The factory clutch apply piston has a sharp, square edge that does not completely apply force across the entire clutch piston. Customers' pictures and movies from drag racing competitions. Its a single-disc, non-captive clutch unit that is somewhat similar to late 300mm 4L60-E converters. The 10L80 transmission is a 10-speed longitudinal automatic transmission that was designed to operate near the efficiency of a CVT while improving fuel economy in GM high-horsepower vehicles highlighted by the Camaro, Suburban, Tahoe, and Escalade. The 10R80 transmission is a 10-speed, rear-wheel-drive transmission that is controlled by a PCM or a TCM. The readers on this site are a pretty sharp bunch. Transmission Pan Bolt Set Chevy 6L80E 6L90E 8L80E 8L90E 10L80E 10L90E 18pcs. var d=new Date(); TAP-2000 is a floor mounted shifter with Tap up Tap Down for GM 6/8L80/90E transmissions. Did the converter clutch material just wear out, thus allowing the clutch and cover to go metal-on-metal? Brake pedal position: Directly affects shift scheduling and TCC scheduling, Air/fuel management adaptive values reset. As you build the best transmission that you can for your customer, you should consider including an updated torque converter in the repair estimate. That is just the beginning. this means that dimension "C" is usually longer than dimension "B". That is RIDICULOUS, Cheryl. Developed with upgraded internal components, Chevrolet Performance's SuperMatic 6L80-E 6-speed automatic transmission offers an exceptional torque rating of 650 lb.-ft. - a 45 percent increase over regular production versions of the 6-speed automatic. Im thinking 3.73. It has factory size tires 275/55/20. Given the complexity of the TCM control strategy, the engineers made every effort to allow for partial operation of the unit under most failure conditions. Fits 6L80, 6L90, 8L90, 10L80 units, TR6060, TR3160 manual units. I see where Summit Racing lists a TCI transmission that was originally a 4L80E but they list it as a six-speed transmission. Then, because the six-speed is splitting ratios, the rpm drop between gears is less because TCI has turned this into a five-speed automatic with an overdrive. This pan fits the GM 6L90, 6L90E transmission, typically found on these vehicles: . The traditional small-block six-bolt bellhousing pattern is the best and easiest way to identify a 4L60E style transmission if you find one at the swap meet for sale. A more recent issue with these units is pump drive gear failure (Figure 7). 3-Bolt Adapter Flange Yoke Kit. Unlike previous shift solenoids, they are mechanical in nature in that no transmission fluid passes through them (Figure 2). It's meant to be used with rear-wheel drive and it requires 8.4 quarts of fluid. Had transmission rebuilt (Pro).My problem is that when it gets around 35, 8L90E Specs, Performance, and Identification, TH400 Transmission Specs, ID, and Common Problems, Mazda 6 P0320: Meaning, Causes, & Diagnosis. A JMBX torque converter rebuilt with a Sonnax forged cover and piston has proven to be a successful recipe for a long-lasting unit, preventing this typical pattern failure. See how the ratios have swapped places? About 80% of issues are cured by updating the programming. We all know that automatic transmission failures can have many root causes. The 6L80 has surprised us power transmission aficionados with its wholesale adoption of new and very different technologies. If there are worn valves or faulty inputs or controls, its easy to see how the clutch could start to shudder and quickly fail. So you would need to begin with a 2008 or newer Express to be able to convert from a 4L80 to a 6L80 / 6L90. or Best Offer . Quick 4 Stand-Alone Transmission Control System In doing this, we evaluated another GM unit the 4L60-E TMBX to see if we could pick up any clues. Most of us have either seen or heard of the new 10-speed transmission Ford is offing behind the 2.3L EcoBoost, 2.7L V6, 3.5L EcoBoost, 5.0L gas, and 3.0L Power Stroke Diesel engines. If concerns are still present, it may be necessary to service or replace the valve body assembly (Figure 6). First introduced in 2005, the 6L80 transmission is a 6-speed automatic gearbox that is made by General Motors at their Willow Run transmission factory in Ypsilanti Michigan, and at their transmission plant in Toledo, Ohio. The way the power is applied is different than the 4L80E / TH-400. I didnt realize that it came equiped with such a lame gear ration 3.08. The small 10-speed gear steps allow the engine speed to drop to lower values than it would in the 6-speed transmission, providing for the best fuel economy. None of the clutch packs can engage, and there is no fail-safe operation. Third 2.15 Then, of course, Sixth gear is still 0.75:1 overdrive. vehicle weights. This platform did not get Gen 4 (58x CKP) engines until 2008. 10L80 Performance Rebuild. Helping transmission shops achievesuccessful and profitable operation. Its a longitudinal transmission (thats what the L in 6L80E stands for). Looking for parts number : new shaft, copling et seal and where to find them. Ford describes their two different shift strategies as single and double step shifts. * DOES NOT INCLUDE A DRIVESHAFT OR CROSSMEMBER. Its extremely important to scan all modules for codes and address those codes first! Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited. Commanded engine torque: Directly affects shift scheduling, TCC scheduling, and transmission diagnostics. NonStop-Transmission. Do you know does the aftermarket have a fix? The idler gear is what drives the pumps driven gear. Starting in 1996, many 4L60E transmissions employed a bolt-on bellhousing. But the cause he discovered was related to the pump. all that is needed is a Throttle position signal and Engine RPM. To handle the increased output torque capacity, the 6L90 departed from the long-standing GM 32 spline specification output shaft of the 6L80 and went to larger diameter 29 spline for most truck applications. The Ford version is built at their Livonia transmission plant (Ford spent a reported $1.4 billion on retooling to build this transmission), and the GM version is built only a few miles away at their transmission factory in Romulus Michigan (GM spent a comparatively cheap $323 million retooling this factory). Objectively, it is a fairly simple repair: simply remove the transmission pan, remove the valve body, unbolt the TEHCM from the valve body and install the new one. One common 6l80 issue due to design flaws include premature clutch failure. The 6L80E uses four under drive gears and two overdrive gears. Special engine computer programming strategies may be required. Gm hydro 10 speed. 10L80 Transmission. The 6L80 began manufacture in 2005 for release in 2006 model year GM vehicles, persisting until at least 2016 in both 6L80 and 6L90 versions. Conveniently, the main transmission that the 6L80E is going to be confused for all have a different number of pan gasket bolts. The solenoids can be replaced separately, but only with the same type of solenoid. But, GM had been in transmission limbo, so to speak, needing a modern transmission to fill the duty gap between the excellently versatile4L60E (and its tougher 4L65 & 4L70 variants)and the Allison transmissions. The GM 10L80 Hydra-Matic transmission is one such hybrid component that General Motors jointly developed with, wait for it, the Ford Motor Company! AM-DT-51190 threads into that port and connects to the J-45096 TransFlow. It is a heavy duty version of the 6L80 six speed automatic with a strengthened input gearset which has two additional pinion gears for six total and a strengthened output gearset that uses wider gears than the 6L80. The bottom line: The very thin (.020") woven carbon friction material cant survive the way the JMBX piston applies. Pre-Owned. Starting with the 2017 Ford F-150, the 10R80 transmission was an option. Our transmission shop specializes in rear wheel drive Ford & GM high performance transmissions. The thought is that the bowl shape of the TMBX is better suited towards a more even apply, and because its thinner, the TMBX piston has the ability to flex and better conform to the front cover. You are browsing camaro6. These solenoids are directly proportional in that zero current equals zero pressure, and maximum current equals maximum pressure. DESIGNED FOR GEN V LT1 & LT4 ONLY. I believe the last digits of the model number are the power rating capabilities of the transmission. For instance, transmission techs with any time under their belts can tell you all about 3-4 clutch failure in GM 4L60-Es, intermediate stub shaft failure in Ford 4R70Ws and solenoid issues in Aisin AW 55-50s. Essentially what TCI did was to engage the overdrive at the back of the trans to split the gear spread between the original First and Second gear ratios and again between Second and Third. While not new to the 6L80, it uses an Input Speed Sensor to monitor input speeds to compare against engine speed and Output Shaft Sensor speed, using this data to adjust shift speeds under instantly detectable conditions. There may or may not be codes associated with these complaints. So is the 10L90 entirely different or does it just have stronger parts? For both types A and B, a freeze-frame record will be stored in memory if the MIL illuminates. As to length, this transmission is 26-1/4" long. As an example, combining the TCI Six-speeds 2.97:1 First gear with a 3.50:1 rear gear ratio is equal to a traditional TH-400 (or stock 4L80E) with a 4.19:1 rear gear. The button for Tap control is on the top of the shifter, making it easy to use in both left and right hand drive vehicles. RECALLS! The original first three gear ratios are in fact still the same as the TH-400. We are High Performance Transmission Builders Sonnax has a line of upgrade parts that address some of the 6L80 and 6L90 transmission weaknesses. check the starter bendix and see if its loose and bouncing off the flywheel. Chevrolet, Buick & GM Engines into the Jeep Ford 1.8L - 2.5L "Pinto" Engines into the Jeep 4L60E (and its tougher 4L65 & 4L70 variants).

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